Elder Of Ziyon - Israel News

Tuesday, June 08, 2010

Did the IDF shoot people from the helicopter?

One of the more consistent stories from the interviews of people aboard the Mavi Marmara is that the IDF started shooting and killing them from the helicopters in the air. For example, from an Al Jazeera reporter on the ship:

Two helicopters at a time hovered above the vessel. Commandos on board the choppers joined the firing, using live ammunition, before any of the soldiers had descended onto the ship.

Two unarmed civilians were killed just metres away from me. Dozens of unarmed civilians were injured right before my eyes.

One Israeli soldier, armed with a large automatic gun and a side pistol, was overpowered by several passengers. They disarmed him. They did not use his weapons or fire them; instead they threw his weapons over board and into the sea.

There have been other reports that made the same accusation.

However, no one was killed from the helicopters.

First of all, if there was really shooting from the choppers, it seems highly unlikely that the IHH thugs would be hanging around on deck like sitting ducks.

Moreover, Turkish forensics reports indicate that all the people killed had 9mm gunshot wounds. I am no gun expert, but a 9mm gun has a limited range and does not seem to be a weapon that could be used with any effectiveness from a helicopter.

The idea that the IDF would send soldiers into an already-existing combat situation - shooting live ammo at the people on deck - while armed with paintball guns is beyond absurd.

Every video I've seen - of the IDF soldiers on the deck and in the boats alongside the ship - show them with paintball guns, not submachine guns or other large lethal weapons.

And one thing is very clear: the witnesses on the ship did not know the difference between paintball guns and large automatic weapons.

Paintball guns have a much wider barrel than ordinary submachine guns, and I can imagine that those guns look terrifying to people, especially since there was so much confusion and the sight of the rappelling soldiers were probably accompanied by non-lethal percussion grenades making loud noises, not to mention the noise of the choppers themselves. There is also no doubt that seeing a paintball gun being shot in such circumstances would also be disorienting - especially if the pellets were of red paint.

This could explain a lot of the discrepancies between the witnesses and the videos/IDF/soldier testimonies. Combine the confusion with the certainty that the activists have to assume that Israel is inherently bloodthirsty and you have the ingredients for highly inaccurate "eyewitness" testimonies. (Other statements, such as the Free Gaza claims that the IDF was shooting people in their sleep or that there was no resistance by the Mavi Marmara people, are absurd on the face of it and have been quietly dropped, although never corrected.)

Libya's leader calls Turkey a Muslim "Trojan Horse" into the EU

Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi, in a speech to a delegation of European Muslim leaders from the Balkans, discussed how he longs for the day that Turkey joins the European Union - and becomes a Trojan Horse for Islam in Europe.

Firas Press reports:

Gaddafi spoke at the meeting on Thursday evening in the Libyan capital Tripoli to the heads of delegations of leaders Islamic People's Leadership, Muammar Friendship & Inter-Communication Forum in the Balkans, and Gaddafi Youth Association of Bosnia and Herzegovina, who were visiting Libya.

He stated: "If Turkey joined the European Union, and the presence of both states of the Balkans are in the European Union and Albania is in the European Union, the meaning of this is that the European continent is no longer crusader or a Christian as it was, but Islam has become a strong partner in the European continent.

"We await the day when Turkey joins the European Union to serve as a Trojan horse, which tells the history."

And Qadhafi, who holds the rotating presidency of the Arab summit, spoke of the importance of demographics that determine the number of Muslims in Europe, said the official statistics were not true, because these tendentious statistics show that Muslims are a minority. However, he said, "There are more Muslims [in Europe] than the numbers declared by the official statistics."

He added, saying: "Fortunately, the Muslims started to multiply and multiply more than the rest of the other religions, maybe this is a sign of God. Thus the will of God, to made Muslims multiply times higher than other peoples. Perhaps this is proof that God wants to be more Muslims than anyone else in the end ."

Gaddafi continued, saying, "Therefore, if [trends continue] so that our numbers increase more, if the Islamic Front in Europe is to defend the Muslims, there will not be another massacre, as experienced in Bosnia and Herzegovina."

He said: "We must unite in Europe, and to be an Islamic state and one under the banner of the World Islamic People's Leadership», pointing out that God created the earth for all people."

Gaddafi concluded by saying: "No one can prevent us from living in Europe: Europe was created by God. Europeans did not create it, and you are the people of Europe, you are European, this is your land. How can you live there and be servile or persecuted?! You cannot."

Interestingly, in 2004, Gaddafi used the same terminology of Turkey being an Islamic "Trojan horse" into Europe - but he stated it as a warning for Europeans to be careful about radical Islam, and AL Qaeda, to enter Europe via Turkey.

PA worried about Hamas political gains, "No humanitarian crisis in Gaza"

The Palestinian Authority is rightly worried that the flotilla incident has strengthened Hamas' rule over Gaza.

From JPost:

The Palestinian Authority is concerned about Turkey’s increased support for Hamas, a PA official in Ramallah said on Monday.

The official said that the PA leadership was “unhappy” with Turkey’s policy toward Hamas, especially with regard to pressure to lift the blockade on the Gaza Strip unconditionally.

“Turkey’s policy is emboldening Hamas and undermining the Palestinian Authority,” the official told The Jerusalem Post.

“Of course we want to see the blockade lifted, but Hamas must also end its coup in the Gaza Strip and accept an Egyptian proposal for achieving reconciliation with Fatah.”

The PA is also concerned the reopening of the Rafah border crossing to Sinai would enable Hamas to tighten its grip on the Strip.

“We wish to remind the Turkish and Egyptian governments that the border crossing was controlled by the Palestinian Authority before Hamas launched its coup in 2007,” the official added. “If the Rafah border crossing is going to be reopened, that should be done in coordination with us and not with Hamas.”

Azzam al-Ahmed, a top Fatah official in the West Bank, was quoted over the weekend as saying that he was opposed to the lifting of the blockade on the Gaza Strip until Hamas agreed to end the dispute with his faction.

Ahmed stressed that there was no humanitarian crisis in the Gaza Strip because the PA government was sending aid through Israeli border crossings.

At the very least, if Hamas does agree to a reconciliation it will be on terms far more favorable to Hamas.

As far as the goods now crossing the Rafah crossing, Egypt is still not allowing cement - but will coordinate the delivery of cement with Israel via the Kerem Shalom crossing to NGOs such as UNRWA.

NYT ignores Reuters photo manipulation story

The New York Times blog, The Lede, has a lengthy overview of the videos and photos that have been released by Israel and Turkey since the raid on the blockade-breaking ships, especially the photos of the Israeli commandos being held hostage. It goes into detail on a number of issues (some of which we covered, some not) about when and how various videos, audio recordings and photographs were released to the public.

Yet throughout that entire article, posted Monday evening, not a word was mentioned about Reuters' blatant manipulation of the Turkish photos that has been a lead story in much of the blogosphere for the previous 24 hours.

Isn't that interesting?

The usual suspects

2nd of June 2010: members of various NGOs gather around a donkey, wrapped in a U.S. flag, stands on an Israeli flag with people’s shoes placed on it during a protest in Karachi.

I wonder which NGOs, btw.

Original marriage in Iraq

Forward to 2:30

I know that this organization is serious business, otherwise I'd be sure this is a Monty Python sketch.

Pearls' Potus, part 2

Pearls Before Swine seems to again be discussing the piece process. Literally.

Zionist pigs attack yet again!

Palestine Press Agency reports on yet another attack of wild boars on the fields of the residents of Salfit - and their utter conviction that Jewish settlers are behind this evil.

Pigs from settlers from the settlement of "Ariel" continued their attacks on the rights of farms and houses in Salfit and surrounding villages.

Witnesses said that a swine herd consisting of twenty pigs attacked the farming communities, breaking down peach and apricot trees...

Witnesses said the pigs made scary sounds and also attacked a field of wheat belonging to farmers Imran Ahmed Khalil Masri and Abu Dar....

The farmers expressed their indignation at the repeated attacks of pigs and have shown that attempts to eliminate them and get rid of them have failed dismally.

Farmer Abu Amer blamed the occupation, saying that they deliberate disseminate pigs for the sabotage and destruction of land, which is then easily stolen by the occupation authorities to establish more settlements.

There's the missing link - I had always assumed from previous Zionist Pig stories that the Jews raised and trained these pigs purely out malice, but now I see it is to drive the Palestinian Arabs away from their land - a new form of ethnic cleansing, of course.

Another vital detail - the evil Jews did not only train the pigs to distinguish between Arab and Jewish farmlands, but they also train them to make scary noises!

And we know that Arabs have, in the past, left their beloved family homes en masse because of nothing more than loud, scary noises.

Is this a gun?

I just again looked at the 9 minute Al Jazeera Mavi Marmara video and saw something I never noticed before:

Doesn't that look like a gun that the IHH is firing at the helicopter? Or is it something else - a camera, a mic?

UPDATE: The LGFers pretty much all think it is a camera. I'm intrigued by the possibility that it was one of the initial kidnapped IDF officer paintball guns.

Proof that Gaza is too crowded

From PCHR:

According to investigations conducted by PCHR, at approximately 6:00, on Sunday 6 June 2010, an unknown object exploded in a land that had been used for training by resistance groups in al-Mawasi area in the west of Rafah. As a result, Mohammed Fayez Dehleez, 15, was seriously wounded, due to which his legs and right hand were cut (amputated.)

The Palestinian police sources stated that they opened an investigation into the reasons of the explosion occurred in the training area, at a time when there was no training at all for any resistance group. The police added that the said site had no clear boundaries and many groups were using it.

You see, because Gaza is so small, we have a tragic situation where the large open areas used for terrorism training must be shared among multiple terror groups. Because of the Israeli siege, proper fencing cannot be built around these vast areas - each of which could comfortably house tens of thousands of people.

So until Israel cedes more of its occupied land in the Negev to Hamas, poor Gaza children will continue to be exposed to the danger of left-over munitions from militant training.The human rights of the terror groups to each have their own, separate, well -protected training areas is being seriously violated.

It is just this sort of human rights abuse that makes Westerners so upset that they must organize flotillas to aid those children in danger of being blown up. All because of Israeli intransigence.

Observation on the Reuters-cropped knives

The IDF came under some derision from skeptics who said that their publication of weapons found on the Mavi Marmara ship were of equipment that one would normally find on a ship, such as ordinary kitchen knives.

The two knives that Reuters originally cropped out do not look like any of the knives in this picture, though.

This is not a kitchen knife nor a utility pocket knife - it is a combat knife, somewhat similar in intended function (sharp point, serrated edge that only reaches to the beginning of the curved part) to this one:

Since we see evidence that combat knives were on the ship, and that they were not apparently found by the Israelis, it corroborates the testimony that the IHH thugs threw their own weapons overboard (and not just IDF weapons, as most of those on the ship have been claiming.)

A good question

Soccer Dad asks:

I was unaware of the story behind Helen Thomas's outburst against Jews.
But I wonder what was wrong about what she said.

As he points out, Thomas' comments - that the Jews should get out of "Palestine" because, presumably, they have no legitimate history there - is the exact same position held by Palestinian "moderates." They still refuse to consider Israel a Jewish state (as opposed to the old days in 1948, when they made a bit more explicit their feelings that their entire problem with Israel was that it was a Jewish state.)

Thomas' feelings are widespread in the Arab world. No one in the West expresses disgust, or even astonishment, when Palestinian Arabs say that the Temples never existed or that the Western Wall was built by the Umayyad Muslim dynasty and is a part of the Waqf. The strong reaction to Thomas' statements could not be because those who are now so offended find the statements themselves offensive. It must be something else:

Helen Thomas, then, didn't say anything offensive. The belief she espoused isn't the problem, it's that she's a Westerner who did. For some arbitrary reason, denying Jewish history is offensive for her to do; had she been a Palestinian politician there'd have been nothing wrong with her statement.

Joe Klein, (via memeorandum) who now tells Helen Thomas to go to the back of the room, regularly vilifies Israel and those defenders of Israel, who - for good reason - are skeptical about the intents of the Palestinians.

The question isn't really what was offensive about Helen Thomas's remarks, but what's innocuous about similar remarks made by Palestinian leadership? If it's wrong for an individual to say that Jews don't belong in Israel, aren't you courting disaster by creating a neighboring state founded on that very principle?

It's more than courting disaster - it is effectively legitimizing the very offensive principle, in this case, by saying that Jews have no historic ties nor religious rights to the holy places and the heartland of ancient Jewish kingdoms.

Why is denying history and historic rights offensive for Thomas and accepted for Israel's ersatz, "moderate," "peace partners?"

Egypt seizes landmines, mortars headed to Gaza

Firas Press reports that Egypt has intercepted a shipment of 100 landmines and 10 mortar shells that were being smuggled to Gaza.

This is just the latest of a long line of such seizures ever since Egypt started increased monitoring of Rafah tunnel crossings in the wake of Hamas' refusal to reconcile with Fatah.

Sheikh Tamimi sacked in corruption scandal

Sheikh Tayseer Tamimi was forced out of his job as the "Palestinian Chief Justice and Supreme Judge" yesterday.

Not because he is singlehandedly responsible for many riots. Not because of his anti-semitism or daily incitement against Jews. Not because of the lies that he habitually hurls about supposed Jewish plans to destroy the Al Aqsa mosque.

No, he is being forced out by Abbas because of an unspecified corruption investigation sparked by the whistle-blower Fahmi Shabana who went on Israeli TV to expose endemic corruption that the PA was trying to cover up.

But don't worry - Tamimi will still enjoy a full pension from the PA, with funds that come from the West to prop up the Abbas regime. And he will be free to incite and lie all he wants.

(As I wrote a few weeks ago, Tamimi has stated in the past that there is no Jewish connection to Jerusalem, that Jews are exporting AIDS to PalArabs, there were never any Temples in Jerusalem, that Jews are planning to massacre Muslims on the Temple Mount and that Jews were planning to demolish Al Aqsa last March. He's also the guy who interrupted the Pope to make a speech about Israeli genocide against Arabs.)

Hamas loves Helen Thomas!

From the Al Qassam Brigades English website (photo from their site as well):

Al Qassam website-June 6, 2010-White house correspondent Helen Thomas told Jews to get out of Palestine. In an interview with her, Jewish man named as David, asked Helen for her comment on Israel, she responded by saying: "Tell them to get the hell out of Palestine."

Turning her attention to the Palestinians, she said, "Remember, these people are occupied. And it's their land," adding the Jews should "go home" to Poland and Germany.

No doubt that Thomas Helen has told the truth that everybody in the world knows, but as American in a very important position , she was attacked by Zionists who went mad from the reality she mentioned in front of all people.

A document released yesterday on You tube, shows Thomas Helen while addressing Jews as " get out of Palestine because it does not belong toyou".

Thomas Helen directly accused by Jews and pro-Israel masses as anti-Semite Nazi.

Israelis ignore the reality, that they never belong in Palestine but belong in some other countries they know better.

Thomas when she asked by David , where Jews should go ? she replied him: "They should go home, German , Poland, America and anywhere else".

She also mentioned that "remember these people are occupied and it is their land , not German and not Poland".

This statement by Thomas Helen reflects the opinion of American majority in USA and all masses who support justice and peace in Palestine an whole world.

Moreover, her statement serves peace process in -Middle East- as they like to call it, to a very great extent.

Peace process will be successful, only when Israel get out of Arab Areas ,Golan and occupied Palestine, then we can say that peace is happily achieved, other wise, and as long Israel occupies Palestine and some Arab lands, peace will never be achieved and more headache will be brought to the world by state of terror-Israel .

Hamas also proudly reproduced the video on Hamas' Almoltaqa message forums.

The last paragraph should be read by every diplomat in the world who thinks that Israeli giving up more land will somehow cause Palestinian Arab claims - and Arab terrorism - to be minimized.

In reality, it would cause such terror to escalate.

Terror did not stop because of Oslo - it increased. Only a short time after Israel withdrew from Area A, giving full day-to-day autonomy to Palestinian Arabs there (well over 95% of them in the West Bank,) the terrorism increased markedly. It took a belated, tough Israeli response to the decade of terror attacks since Oslo to prompt the Palestinian Arabs (temporarily, in the timeframes in which they think) to reduce their attacks.

Israel's withdrawal from Gaza also did not stop rockets towards Israel - rather, after a brief relative lull, they increased. Only another tough Israeli response forced Hamas to (again temporarily) work to rein in the attacks (while claiming victory.)

Israeli concessions do not help peace at all - they embolden terror. The only serious deterrent to terrorism is a tough and consistent response that makes the terrorists realize that they have something to lose by their continued attacks. Westerners who pressure Israel alone to make concessions are giving the Palestinian Arab side precious little incentive to make any compromises for peace.

As this article shows, even the terrorist group the Al Qassam Brigades has taken the language and terminology of the "peace process" to be a weapon for them to achieve their goals to destroying Israel. Just as the Fatah terror group is now tactically repeating to the West via the PA that there will be no peace until Israel leaves 100% the "occupied territories, " the Hamas terror group is saying the same thing - just their explicit definition of the "occupied territories" is all of Israel.

If Israel would give away 100% of the land gained in a defensive war against Jordan in 1967, the next step would be people demanding the Arab areas of the Galillee. Then Jaffa. Then would come demands for the land that Israel "occupied" in the 1948 war over the UN partition boundaries (not to mention the return of millions of descendants of refugees to their nonexistent homes and fields in Israel.) If Israel gave those back, then they would demand the rest of "historic Palestine" (and an apology from Britain for the Balfour Declaration.)

The pattern is clear and it can be seen in this article. It is not only Hamas - ordinary Palestinian Arabs also believe, deep down, that Israel will be defeated sooner or later.

I had mentioned in a post a few months back about visiting a friendly Arab pottery shop in Hebron, where I was invited to drink coffee and Mrs. Elder was given an opportunity to use the potters' wheel. A great deal of their business is from Jewish tourists to the Tomb of the Patriarchs across the street.

Commenter viiit wrote:

I went to the same pottery shop in January.

The same friendly Arab/Muslim has treated me to some coffee.

I asked him about the plate he hand hanging on the wall. On it there was the map of "Palestine" without Tel Aviv. (Jaffo was there.)

He explained to me that all of Palestine was Arab and that they will get it back. It was only a matter of time, maybe 2 years, maybe 10 years, maybe a little longer, but with NO DOUBT it will come back to the Arabs. He assured me with all sincerity.

I asked him what will happen to the Jews, he said that they will be asked to leave, and if they don't wish to leave voluntarily they will be made to leave.

I then told him that I was a Jew. Then suddenly he told me with equal conviction that he is a man of peace, and that he only wants peace, and that Jews and Arabs can learn to co-exist. Of course he would wish that Jews would leave on their own, but if they don't then he is prepared to live with them together.

He also told me that his grandfather had 2 wifes and 21 children and by now he has 140 grand children and more are coming.

I was astounded by his ability to express two contradictory stands , without even noticing that there was any contradiction. He was a well educated and quite wealthy man. I think that this quality of speaking out of two sides of ones moth is part of Arab and Muslim culture.

I instinctively distrust Arabs and Muslims.

This is not a lone example. Arabs have even told their leftist Israeli friends the same thing (shocking many of them.) Whether one wants to generalize from this encounter to all Arabs and Muslims aside, it does illustrate that the Arab hatred for Jews (or at the very least the conviction that Jews should be at best a tolerated minority with limited rights) is far more than just political - it is cultural. But this is not something that you will see in op-eds by Arabs in the Washington Post or even in the Al Qassam website. They will happily use the language of the "peace process" to get the West to pressure Israel to help achieve their goals.

Nothing but continued and consistent Israeli strength can push that desire into the background. (It will never disappear, any more than the Muslim desire for Andalusia will never disappear.) The tactics may differ, and some may be more pragmatic than others about the possibilities of achieving the goal of a Palestine replacing Israel, but the goal has not changed one iota.

Helen Thomas has emboldened some to attempt to achieve it sooner rather than later, with the help of the US and clueless Europeans.

Believing otherwise is nothing more than wishful thinking, and too many in the West impose that wishful thinking on Israelis' daily lives.

(h/t OG)